What is Shreddits opinion on Rammstein?

GuitarWizard90 · 2012-05-22T17:19:39.105031+00:00

Good topic idea by the way. I'm not sure why people are downvoting it; probably insecure indie rockers.

GuitarWizard90 · 2012-05-22T17:19:19.660408+00:00

The original definition of metal was Black Sabbath and similar bands. Over time, we've learned a bit more.

Here's my intro list:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Metal/comments/tzff8/what_is_metal_how_do_you_define_it/c4r132h

thesatsui · 2012-05-22T17:18:34.037495+00:00

Attributes:

Phrasal riffs
Riff-glueing/narrative song structure
Dark, apocalyptic, religious mood (even when atheistic)
Tends toward the chromatic and minor key
Epic song structures

mayonesa · 2012-05-22T16:02:38.021402+00:00

It's the age, not the intention. The new St. Vitus could be either gold or crap. If they decide they want money or popularity over music, then that's what it's going to be.

GuitarWizard90 · 2012-05-22T16:02:02.139659+00:00

Wikipedia is a poor source. By that definitely, anyone using heavy distortion is metal.

mayonesa · 2012-05-22T14:55:27.895297+00:00

Hardcore kind of died in the 1980s, with a few exceptions. A parallel to this album is DRI's Crossover, which also achieved the seamless fusion. DRI has stayed a bit more productive in terms of quality, however!

mayonesa · 2012-05-22T14:28:31.007028+00:00

Sadly true. Animosity is one of those great albums that sounds like its own name, e.g. it makes me want to bring it a glass of water and call security.

Immortal_Fishy · 2012-05-22T14:26:22.070495+00:00

Classical instrumentation does not coexist so well with loudly distorted guitars. You might try Earthen Grave, which has a classical violinist in the band, and early At the Gates. For theatrical/Wagnerian, mid-period Celtic Frost of course!

Samccx19 · 2012-05-22T14:25:00.965339+00:00

NOT METAL, NOT GOOD

popctrl · 2012-05-22T14:22:47.651553+00:00

Redditors are generally too stupid to understand this, but bands can be both serious and have a sense of humor. Most of metal does it. It's just Redditors who don't get it.

GuitarWizard90 · 2012-05-22T14:22:04.352248+00:00

NOT METAL

Nuvoletta180 · 2012-05-22T14:21:37.373824+00:00

Awesome. I hope someone else enjoys that!

dvance · 2012-05-22T14:21:15.745847+00:00

So how is this line drawn?

Set up a point of reference and use it to (generously, favoring the newcomer) divide the material.

Obscure music gets posted here? That's news.

It tends to get drowned out by Redditor preferences for indie-metal, but they do like music that is technically obscure.

From lengthy experience, everything you consider good starts off as obscure.

Here's what I said:

there's not a whole lot of obscure that's really any good.

Meaning that the obscure that's good quickly differentiates itself.

Dr_Mc_Bock · 2012-05-22T14:19:34.247472+00:00

They're imaginary all right. Redditors think I should be threatened by their collective opinion, but I'm not. These are just people sitting behind computers and what's more fascinating is that equality is a myth: quantity is not greater than quality. Even if "They" hate me, the good ones tend to be amused... :)

dvance · 2012-05-22T01:29:04.924595+00:00

A few ways:

Musical standards
Artistic standards
Overall deviation from the average

This isn't a jihad to eliminate any music that might be bad, but to cut out the obvious garbage so that people can come in here and get exposed to quality metal. That will in turn further the genre and make /r/metal a place to learn about actual metal instead of being barraged by a bunch of bands that hipsters like because they're obscure.

dvance · 2012-05-22T01:27:40.392999+00:00

Which is completely subjective, despite your claims to the contrary.

Not at all. To anyone with a modicum of musical or artistic experience, it's easy to draw a line separating the aimless crap from that which has potential. This line should be generous, but nonetheless, it should be there.

Right now we're supporting garbage music just because it's obscure. From lengthy experience, there's not a whole lot of obscure that's really any good. It's important to have quality control so that the best rises.

mayonesa · 2012-05-22T01:26:17.344538+00:00

\m/ -I- \m/

dvance · 2012-05-21T22:56:01.920890+00:00

You're deflecting here.

The new idea is to change how things are done. That's definition of new idea, no?

The rules of the forum would have to be flexible.

Saying "I don't see anything new here" is a way of backing out and declaring victory without addressing the issue.

I think I've spoken clearly:

Penalizing metal for being good but popular results in lots of metal that is obscure but bad
The converse, which penalizing music for being obscure but good, would miss out on that music
The only compatible standard for both instances is to simply pick music that is good

"Bad metal is still metal" you say, which means that you acknowledge sacrificing quality for some misguided notion of inclusiveness.

I suggest instead we simply focus on quality, because that's what is most important.

dvance · 2012-05-21T22:49:14.336286+00:00

I'm not seeing any ideas that aren't already exercised by myself and the other mods which don't contravene the agreed-upon rules of the forum.

You remove low-quality metal already?

Connor92 · 2012-05-21T22:42:38.404731+00:00

That's retarded.

Connor92 · 2012-05-21T22:32:34.014905+00:00

Dismember - "Torn Apart" (from Pieces)

dvance · 2012-05-21T22:28:24.402621+00:00

How?

Use judgment independent of personal taste.

It would be disingenuous to censor what can objectively be called metal just because we don't like it.

As said above and before, simply choose by quality instead of personal preference.

Nuvoletta180 · 2012-05-21T22:20:43.877159+00:00

FRIED ABORTION, COMING RIGHT UP

dvance · 2012-05-21T22:16:45.914695+00:00

Again, if "quality" is defined by you, me, and the other mods, that simply further engenders "a group gathering who have similar sentiments and exclude outsiders", which puts us right back where we started.

Not if it's done objectively, which is easily possible.

I think it's important that people are exposed to all different aspects of, in this case, metal, so that they're free to exercise their own judgment, to the extent that they have any to begin with, which, for the sake of argument, I'm assuming they do.

There are ample opportunities for them to encounter shitty music. I don't think that's a problem for anyone in the modern world.

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